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Author Topic: Virginia Tech Shootings  (Read 12267 times)

Santa Claus

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Re: Virginia Tech Shootings
« Reply #60 on: April 20, 2007, 12:23:16 AM »

Page 5!

The guys from England commenting in this thread are just giving opinions through our eyes. Of course we can't properly comment on what it's like the US, because we don't live there. It's like you commenting on stuff in England - you can't really get a grip of it because you don't live here, but you can relate it to your own country, and draw some conclusions that are your opinions. So what we're really doing is just giving a different perspective on stuff.

I just find it interesting to look at how in the US, gun laws are very liberal and gun crime is relatively high, whereas in the UK, gun laws are very tight and gun crime is relatively low. Here you are guaranteed to go to prison for at least 4 years if you are caught with a gun in any public place. But are those two things really related?

The culture in the US is completely different, so gun laws will not necessarily have the same impact on gun crime as many people think - restricting guns will not necessarily reduce gun crime.

Side note because I'm curious: how many of you carry your guns with you regularly rather than leaving them at home the whole time?
« Last Edit: April 20, 2007, 12:26:21 AM by Santa Claus »
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uituit

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Re: Virginia Tech Shootings
« Reply #61 on: April 20, 2007, 12:26:34 AM »

After the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Arthur_massacre we had a out cry for tougher gun control.The government introduced a buy back scheme,but only the honest people took part in this scheme.

Gun control really only works for the non crimenal,but on the other hand all of these massacas where done by people have been abused at school(columbine) or have mental and social problems(port arther, virginia tech),many of these people are not professional criminals.

From the news reports  i have seen ,the virginia tech shooter only purchased his weapons a week or so before the massacre,In this day and age more and more people are having social and mental problems.
If gun control was tighter maybe this event would never had happend,with a proper backgroud check ,im sure they would have found out more about this fuck wit,wasnt he in troble for stalking someone?  'thats ok give him a gun anyway ,he wont use it for something evil' .

Those who own guns here .How stringent are the background checks?especially the mental heath checks? do you have to  talk with a shrink or do they just check your past history for mental illnes (if any)?

Some of you have stated its not a gun control problem thats true, its a social problem that causes theses tragic events.Thats what needs to be fixed in australia and around the world.

Santa Claus

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Re: Virginia Tech Shootings
« Reply #62 on: April 20, 2007, 12:30:33 AM »

After the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Arthur_massacre we had a out cry for tougher gun control.The government introduced a buy back scheme,but only the honest people took part in this scheme.

Gun control really only works for the non crimenal,but on the other hand all of these massacas where done by people have been abused at school(columbine) or have mental and social problems(port arther, virginia tech),many of these people are not professional criminals.

From the news reports  i have seen ,the virginia tech shooter only purchased his weapons a week or so before the massacre,In this day and age more and more people are having social and mental problems.
If gun control was tighter maybe this event would never had happend,with a proper backgroud check ,im sure they would have found out more about this fuck wit,wasnt he in troble for stalking someone?  'thats ok give him a gun anyway ,he wont use it for something evil' .

Those who own guns here .How stringent are the background checks?especially the mental heath checks? do you have to  talk with a shrink or do they just check your past history for mental illnes (if any)?

Some of you have stated its not a gun control problem thats true, its a social problem that causes theses tragic events.Thats what needs to be fixed in australia and around the world.


That's a really interesting point I think a lot of people around the world have missed - if criminals want a firearm, they will get it. It's not hard in any country if you know what you're doing. But with things like the Virginia Tech massacre, perhaps it wouldn't have happened if Cho Seung-hui wasn't able to get a weapon - he wasn't a criminal before it happened. Could be something to dwell on.
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Herman169

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Re: Virginia Tech Shootings
« Reply #63 on: April 20, 2007, 01:30:41 AM »

Those who own guns here .How stringent are the background checks?especially the mental heath checks? do you have to  talk with a shrink or do they just check your past history for mental illnes (if any)?


Uit idk if your asking or just stateing the fact the a gun salesman doesn't have access to that info., idk if it's just virginia or rest of usa but i guess there is a confidently (spelt wrong) where that information isn't needed, which i think is dumb.
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thewall86

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Re: Virginia Tech Shootings
« Reply #64 on: April 20, 2007, 02:19:55 AM »

I think people should be allowed to have guns if they want them and are mentally stable adults.

I also think this thing at VT wouldn't have happened if it was illegal to purchase a firearm. Whether anybody can carry it in public is a different issue, and I don't think it would have changed this situation much at all.

This incident is the best example of why guns should be illegal to own. Yet, I still believe law-abiding citizens that are mentally stable should be allowed to own one if they wish. 99% of legal gun owners do not commit crimes with them. But it gives them a chance to protect themselves from criminals of greed. This guy falls in the .0001% of legal gun carriers that just happens to be a homocidal maniac. Yes, not allowing him easy access to the gun may have prevented this. But there's nothing you can really do beyond that.

One rotten bastard shouldn't ruin it for everybody. Depending on how determined he was, which he seems to be since he obviously got these guns for this purpose, he could have done just about anything. This isn't a case of a gun-owner snapping. This is a case of an evil fucker using a gun as the means to carry out his destruction.
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ccfan4326

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Re: Virginia Tech Shootings
« Reply #65 on: April 20, 2007, 02:34:40 AM »

I really don't see why anyone needs to own a gun. They're designed to kill things. Non-lethal weapons can be used in defense and for hunting guns can be restricted to hunting grounds or whatever.

However, there does need to be a line drawn somewhere. There will always be fucked up people that find a way to kill, and as our population increases the probably of that happening increases. Someone could make a bomb and blow up a school. You can't do much to stop than other than preventing the person from entering the campus in the first place. So then what? Surround the campus with a wall and do strip searches on everyone entering?

Some people we won't be able to stop, but we can try to make it harder to kill. Guns make it pretty easy. I think they should be restricted in some form, but I'm not sure how it should be done or to what extent.

Also, this incident was sad, but in the overall picture these events are extremely rare. More people die from guns outside of school, and schools are still one of the safest places to be, but people don't pay attention to that because it's not plastered all over the news.
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vloktboky

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Re: Virginia Tech Shootings
« Reply #66 on: April 20, 2007, 02:55:30 AM »

If a person wants to own a gun, it's of no concern to any of you.  If a person attempts to use said gun to violate any of your rights, then and only then does it become a concern of yours and you have every right to do what is necessary to insure your rights aren't violated, so long as your rights are honestly in jeopardy and you are willing to accept any consequences that come your way.

What you can do at any time is base your opinion on a person as you see fit.  If I see anyone concealing a weapon, they immediately become an idiot in my book and that is exactly how I perceive to treat them.  That's my way of protesting their choice without directly questioning their right to do whatever the Hell they want.  You should do the same.  Mylum, if that picture is really of you, you're a dumbass.  I'm not at all impressed. :)

Now quit bickering about gun laws.  You're making it easy to pick one out thanks to Google Ads at at the bottom of this page.  (Or at least a REALLY SUPER COOL! pistol ringtone.)
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Santa Claus

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Re: Virginia Tech Shootings
« Reply #67 on: April 20, 2007, 10:17:50 AM »

Heh @ ads.

wall and cc picked up on another thing that compares the US & UK in this area - in most places in the US, it's legal to kill someone to protect your property, e.g. shoot them for trespassing, right? (correct me if I'm wrong here?) whereas in the UK it's illegal to do anything to anyone other than self-defence, and even that has to be "reasonable and relative force", though it's starting to get a bit of a grey area.
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gb987

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Re: Virginia Tech Shootings
« Reply #68 on: April 20, 2007, 11:28:24 AM »

the thought of bringing a gun to school in the is something that really scares me and would be a completely crazy idea over here, i doubt anyone i know has ever seen a gun in school or knows anyone who has, that really shows the different cultire as you said, but its not a joke to say we cant comment on it, we all live in the same planet, guns to the same thing over here as they do over there in the us, i still think, the less guns around = less gun crimes, if there arent any guns people cant shoot people, legalising guns does increase the number of guns around, and for me that has to increase the number of gun crimes
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mylumnad

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Re: Virginia Tech Shootings
« Reply #69 on: April 20, 2007, 12:24:09 PM »

If a person wants to own a gun, it's of no concern to any of you.  If a person attempts to use said gun to violate any of your rights, then and only then does it become a concern of yours and you have every right to do what is necessary to insure your rights aren't violated, so long as your rights are honestly in jeopardy and you are willing to accept any consequences that come your way.

What you can do at any time is base your opinion on a person as you see fit.  If I see anyone concealing a weapon, they immediately become an idiot in my book and that is exactly how I perceive to treat them.  That's my way of protesting their choice without directly questioning their right to do whatever the Hell they want.  You should do the same.  Mylum, if that picture is really of you, you're a dumbass.  I'm not at all impressed. :)

Now quit bickering about gun laws.  You're making it easy to pick one out thanks to Google Ads at at the bottom of this page.  (Or at least a REALLY SUPER COOL! pistol ringtone.)


Thanks, you just made my day. You know you love that picture of me.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2007, 12:31:13 PM by mylumnad »
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N00BIN8R

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Re: Virginia Tech Shootings
« Reply #70 on: April 20, 2007, 12:35:11 PM »

If a person wants to own a gun, it's of no concern to any of you.  If a person attempts to use said gun to violate any of your rights, then and only then does it become a concern of yours and you have every right to do what is necessary to insure your rights aren't violated, so long as your rights are honestly in jeopardy and you are willing to accept any consequences that come your way.

Well said, Sir! And you might want to be armed in that instance... just in case...

Quote
Those who own guns here .How stringent are the background checks?

North Carolina's Firearms Law

Quote
That's a really interesting point I think a lot of people around the world have missed - if criminals want a firearm, they will get it. It's not hard in any country if you know what you're doing. But with things like the Virginia Tech massacre, perhaps it wouldn't have happened if Cho Seung-hui wasn't able to get a weapon - he wasn't a criminal before it happened. Could be something to dwell on.

You are correct... he was NOT a criminal.  But he WAS ineligible (by VA Law) to carry a handgun based on his mental problems.  The gun dealer is SUPPOSED to contact the FBI for a check in the NICS database which includes checks on:

  • Illegal Alien Files
  • Controlled substance abuse
  • Dishonorable Discharge from the Military
  • Citizenship renunciation
  • Mental commitments
  • Wanted Persons
  • Domestic Violence Protection
  • Criminal History files

According to what the news outlets have chosen to show us, he should have been flagged for at least two of these... Which leads me to believe that the gun-dealer did not do what he is supposed to do.
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MyzeryGrl

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Re: Virginia Tech Shootings
« Reply #71 on: April 20, 2007, 02:53:44 PM »

Bear arms... lol... Family guy ftw.
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xav69

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Re: Virginia Tech Shootings
« Reply #72 on: April 20, 2007, 03:10:05 PM »

I dunno but for my 2 cents, i dont think people should be allowed to have guns in their homes. THats what the cops are there for. For example. My mother is a special education teacher. One day a student with a mental problem came into class with a live handgrenade and handed it to her and he pulled the pin. My old lady just launched it out the window into the play field knowing there was no one there. What im getting at is, for our children's sake and for the sake of knowing there are millions of people in the world that are unstable, having weapons such as guns in the house is unnecessary. Im pretty sure there are many other ways to deter criminals from entering a house such as home security and perhaps pepper spray or tazers. anyway i dont feel like getting flamed, just throwing my 2 cents in the pond.

I lold when i was told that where the massacre took place, the state allows you to buy a gun every month. why the fuck is there a law stating u can buy only 1 gun a month? do u want someone to start his/her own personal army. Within a couple of years u can own a dozens of guns for what purpose. fucking wierd
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N00BIN8R

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Re: Virginia Tech Shootings
« Reply #73 on: April 20, 2007, 03:58:51 PM »

I dunno but for my 2 cents, i dont think people should be allowed to have guns in their homes. THats what the cops are there for.

Sorry... but I do not recall ever seeing a cop in my house... And the knowledge that I have the means to protect myself and my property means alot more to me than the thought that some cop may show-up seven minutes after I get shot by an intruder because HE had a gun, and I didn't.
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N00BIN8R

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Re: Virginia Tech Shootings
« Reply #74 on: April 20, 2007, 04:01:12 PM »

Side note because I'm curious: how many of you carry your guns with you regularly rather than leaving them at home the whole time?

Leaving it at home kinda defeats the purpose of having it, imo.  I carry (except in banks, on school grounds, in bars, in crowded places, libraries, etc... then it's concealed in the car).
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